tv Outnumbered FOX News February 9, 2015 9:00am-10:01am PST
jon: see you back here in one hour. jenna: "outnumbered" starts now. >> we begin with this fox news alert. we are watching the lecturns there as we await president obama and pearlman chancellor angela merkel. they're expected to give dual news conference. a couple of things are expected to come up. not least of which will be the ukrainian crisis, ukraine and russia as they head towards what looks to be a further conflict over their already so much bloodshed. these are two countries, the united states and germany that are pledging to stick together to find some sort of peaceful way forward. of course our relations with germany right now are a little shaky. might even be described as frosty based on nsa and cia spying that we did, reportedly involved angela merkel's phone and some leaders she was talking
to in europe. so the united states, germany getting together on this i want to go straightaway to ed henry. let's go around the couch. this is "outnumbered." i'm harris faulkner. there is apdrea tan tear ross, ainsley ear heart and bill hemmer, coanchor of "america's newsroom." he is outnumbered. >> great to be back with you, ladies. how would you rather start the week with "outnumbered." every monday is great with martha. every monday. >> we'll talk about lying relationships later in the show. >> that's freight. i'm glad you're here. >> thank you harris. >> we talked a lot about this topic alot during your hour two. let's bring in ed henry. in the east room. haven't gotten two minute warning.
>> reporter: got the two minute warning, harris. there was tension because of nsa eavesdropping scandal. this relationship will be tested again at this news conference because we're reaching a critical juncture with the crisis in ukraine. angela merkel as well as french leaders, president hollande and others suggested there be wednesday deadline for vladmir putin to finally help he diffuse this crisis in ukraine. we see reports of russian troops and russian arms crossing border into ukraine to help the russian separatists it. obviously something both president obama and angela merkel want to stop but how you do it may be where they diverge. if vladmir putin does not follow through on this wednesday deadline and calm the crisis down angela merkel is pushing for more sanctions. president obama wants more sanctions but is now weighing whether or not to have the u.s. help arm the ukrainians. to defend themselves. that is something he has been under pressure before. hasn't done it. we'll see at this news
conference whether he finally reveals whether he is ready to do that, harris. >> i know how this works. you have to sit down as they pull into place. i will come back to you after the president and angela merkel speak. let's bring it back out to the couch. bill, we've been talking about this all morning long. ahead of this decision is this next meeting. we're not invited to that, the united states. you have germany, france, ukraine and russia but we won't be there. >> my guess is what ed reported is exactly right. she will look more time. frankly we'll give it to them. we'll get past wednesday. i have not seen a tendency for this white house to go ahead and arm ukraine. it hasn't happened yet. bear in mind the sanctions have had an effect and had an effect for six months plus on russian economist. the oligarchs that are so wealthy inside of russia but no one anticipated the drop in oil prices which is having a significant impact on their economy as well. >> we're watching this, as both leaders pull to the lecturns and begin this dual news conference. we'll watch together.
>> good morning everybody. please be seated. as always it is a great pleasure to welcome my close friend and partner chancellor angela merkel back to the white house. angela of course has been here many times but this visit is a chance for me to congratulate her on two achievements well into her third term, angela is germany's longest serving chancellors. perhaps more importantly this is my first opportunity to publicly congratulate angela and berm any on their fourth world cup title. as we all saw in rio, angela is one of her team's biggest fans. our u.s. team however gets better each world cup. so watch out in 2018. germany is one of our strongest allies so whenever we meet it is an opportunity to coordinate closely on a whole range of issues critical to our shared
security and prosperity. as angela and our berman friends prepare to host the g 7 this spring it is also important for us to be able to coordinate on a set of shared goals and in our working lunch this afternoon we'll focus on what we can do to keep the economy growing and creating jobs. as strong supporters of the transatlantic trade and investment partnership we agree there needs to be meaningful progress this year towards an agreement that pasts our economies with strong protections for consumers and workers and environment. i look forward to hearing angela's assessment how europe and imf can work with the new greek government to find a way that returns greece to sustainable growth within the eurozone, where growth is critical to both the united states and the global economy. and we'll be discussing our work to get all major economies to take ambitious action on climate change including our initiative to limit public financing for
coal-fired power plants overseas. and our global efforts to phase down some of the most dangerous greenhouse greenhouse gases. our discussion this morning focused on global security issues. we reaffirmed our commitment to training afghan security force and supporting a sovereign, secure and united afghanistan. we afree that the international community has to continue enforcing existing sanctions as part of our diplomatic effort to prevent iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon even as the p5-plus-one works closely together to everything we can to try to achieve a good verifiable deal. two issues in particular that dominated our work day this morning. russia's aggression against ukraine and international fight against isil. with regard to russia, and the separatists it supports in ukraine, it's clear they have violated just about every commitment they made in the
minsk agreement. instead of withdrawing from eastern ukraine, russian forces continue to operate there training separatists and helping coordinate attacks. instead of withdrawing its arms, russia sent in more tanks and orme mored -- armored personal carriers and heavy artillery. with russian support separatists seized more territory and shelled civilvillian airs -- civilian areas and driven more ukrainians from their homes. these are the facts. russian aggression only reinforced unity of united states and germany and our allies around the world. i want to thank angela for the strong leadership and partnership as we met the challenge. chancellor merkel and vice president biden met with ukrainian president borrow cheng coover the weekend. we continue to encourage a diplomatic resolution to this issue and as diplomatic efforts continue this week we are in
absolute agreement that the 21st century can not stand idle. have us stand idle and simply allow the borders of europe to be redrawn at the barrel of a gun. we agreed to move forward our strategy. along with our nato allies we'll keep bolstering our presence in central and eastern europe, part of our unwaiverring article v obligation to our collective defense. we will continue to work with the imf and other partners to provide ukraine with critical financial support as it pursues economic and anticorruption reforms. we discussed issue how best to assist ukraine as it defends itself and we agreed sanctions on russia need to remain fully enforced until russia complies fully wits obligations. even as we continue to work for a diplomatic solution we are making it clear again today if russia continues on its current
course, which is ruining the russian economy and hurting the russian people as well having such a terrible effect on ukraine, russia's isolation will only worsen both politically and economically. with regard to isil, germany and the united states remain united in our determination to destroy this barbaric organization. i thanked angela for her strong support as a member of the international coalition that is working in iraq. in a significant milestone in its foreign policy germany has taken the important steps of equiping kurdish forces in iraq. germany is preparing to leave the training mission of local forces in ear beale. everybody beale. erbil. that was focus of the and under angela's leadership, germany is moving ahead with new legislation to prevent fighters
from traveling to and from syria and iraq. at the same time both angela and i recognize that young people in both our countries especially in muslim communities, are being threatened and targeted for recruitment by terrorists like al qaeda and isil. an protecting young people from this hateful ideology so they're not vulnerable to such recruitment is foremost a task for local communities, family neighbors, faith leaders who know their community best but we could help these communities starting with the tone and example that we set in our own countries. i want to commend angela for her leadership. her leadership speaking out forcefully against xenophobia and prejudice and on behalf of pluralism and diversity. she made it clear all religious communities have a place in germany, just as they do here in the united states. and we're greatful that our german friends will be joining us at our summit next week on
countering violent extremism, this is challenge our countries have to meet together. let me end on an historic note. this year marks the 70th anniversary of the end of the second world war. it marks the 25th anniversary of reunification of germany. so at a time when conflicts around the world sometimes seem intractable, when progress sometimes seems beyond grasp germany's story gives us hope. we can end wars countries can rebuild, adversaries can become allies walls come down divisions can be healed. germany's story and story of angela's life remind us when free people stand united our interests and our values will ultimately prevail. as we look to the future, as i prepare to visit the bavaria in june i'm grateful for my partnership with angela as americans are grateful for their partnership with the people of
germany. chancellor merkel. >> [speaking german] >> translator: thank you mr. palm. i'm delighted to be back in washington. nine months ago we were here for the last time. this has a lot to do with first and foremost we have assumed the presidency this year and we coordinate on these matters very closely as we do on others. obviously we'll digest issues related to the global economy when we meet in bavaria and the summer. from a european vantage point i think we can say that we have made significant progress in a number of areas. we have countries who now back on the path. ireland comes to mind but portugal, based on structural reforms they have now made significant progress. new commission, new european
commissioners come in office launch ad growth program in which berm any will participate. we will pin our hopes basically on growth but, and infrastructure but on also other growth projects. digital economy i think of the state of the digital economy in the united states there is a lot of things to be done by the europeans now. i would say that a free-trade agreement, conclusion of a free-trade agreement would also go a long way towards boosting growth. we know very much you are engaged in the asian-pacific area and there are a lot of trade agreements there as well and germany will come out forcefully seeing that the negotiations between the e.u. and united states on free-trade agreements are pursued in a vigorous manner. it is in our own vested interests and interests of the united states but also in the german interests. we are dealing basically on our g7 agenda with health issues.
let me just mention one. what sort of lessons have we drawn, for example for the terrible ebola epidemic? i think one thing we've learned that is that international organizations, the international community has about be quicker reacting to such epidemics and g7 can give important contribution to doing this. we're also interested, for example, in seeing gavi be successful. we're like to conclude the replenishment conference completed in germany so successfully. we dealt with security issues this morning. it is true germany this year celebrates the 25th anniversary of its reunification. this would not have been possible, not have been achievable without transatlantic partners and without the supports of the united states of america and we will always be grateful for this. there is one case in point that it is well worth of the effort to stand by one's values for decades and to pursue long-term goals and not relent in those
efforts. after we thought in the '90s maybe that things would turn out somewhat more easily, somewhat less complicated, now we see ourself con fronted with a whole wealth of conflicts complex ones at that. we worked together in afghanistan. we talked about this as well. germany has decided in its fight against isil to give help to deliver training missions, to deliver also weapons and if necessary, we work together on the iran nuclear program where we also enter into a crucial phase of negotiations. one particular priority was given to the conflict between ukraine and russia this morning. we stand up for the same principles of inviability of territorial integrity. as someone that comes from europe, if we give up this principle of territorial integrity of countries we will
not be able to maintain the peaceful order of europe we've been able to achieve. this is not just any old point this is an essential al and crucial point. we have to stand by it and russia has violated territorial integrity of ukraine in two respects. in crimea and in don't neck. -- donetsk. we have required to come up with solutions but not in the sense of a mediator but we also stand up for the interests of the european peaceful order. this is what the french president and i have been trying to do over the past few days. we're going to continue those efforts. i'm very grateful throughout the ukraine crisis we have been in very, very close contact with the united states of america and europe on sanctions, on diplomatic initiatives and this is going to be continued. and i think that's indeed one of the most important messages we can send to russia and need to send to russia.
we continue to pursue a diplomatic solution although we have suffered a lot of setbacks. these days we'll see whether all sides are ready and willing to come to a negotiated settlement. i've always said i don't see a military solution to this conflict but we have to put all our efforts in bringing about a diplomatic solution. so there is a whole host of issues we need to discuss. overlunch we'll talk about climate protection and sustainable development and sustainable development goals. yet again thank you very much for the close cooperation. very close coordination and possibility to have an exchange of views on all of these crucial issues. not only in hindsight can we safely say that the united states have always stood by us and helped us to regain your unity in peace and freedom but we can also say we continue to cooperate closely if it is about solving the conflicts of the world today and unfortunately
there are many of them and we will continue to do so in the future. thank you for your hospitality. >> first question, steve musen, "washington post.". >> thank you. you said, stressed that u.s. and europe need to have cohesion on the issue of sanctions and dealing with ukraine and yet the administration is discussing sending lethal weapons to ukraine which is very different from what the chancellor said over the weekend. i was wondering this is a good cop, bad cop act or is this real reflection of difference of views on the situation on the ground? and more broadly if there is no agreement this week, what lies ahead? are we looking at broader set of sanctions. what makes us think those set of sanctions will change the russian president's mind anymore than the current ones? >> well, let me start with the
broader point. i think both angela and i have emphasized that the prospect for a military solution to this problem has always been low. russia obviously has a extraordinarily powerful military and you know given the length of the russian border with ukraine given the history between russia and ukraine, expecting that if russia is determined that you crain can fully rebuff a russian army has always been unlikely. but what we have said is that the international community, working together, can ratchet up the costs for the violation of
the core principle of sovereignty and territorial integrity and that's exactly what we've done. and russia has paid a significant cost for its actions first in crimea and now in eastern ukraine. it has not yet dissuaded mr. putin from following the course that he is on but it has, created a measureable negative impact on the russian economy and that will continue. my hope is that through these diplomatic efforts those costs have become high enough that mr. putin's preferred option is for a diplomatic resolution. and i won't prejudge whether or not they will be successful. if they are successful, it will be in part because of the extraordinary patience and
effort of chancellor merkel and her team. if they are not, then we will continue to raise those costs and we will not relent in that and one of the things i'm very encouraged about is the degree to which we've been able to maintain u.s., european unity on this issue. now, it is true that if in fact diplomacy fails what i've asked my team to do is look at all options. what other means can we put in place to change mr. putin's calculus and the possibility of lethal defensive weapons is one of those options being examined. i have not made a decision about that yet. i've consulted with not just angela but will be consulting with other allies about this issue. it is not based on the idea that
ukraine could defeat a russian army that was determined. it is rather to see whether or not there are additional things we can do to help ukraine bolster its defenses in the face of separatist aggression. but i want to emphasize that a decision has not yet been made. one of the bigger issues that we're also concerned with making sure the ukrainian economy is functioning and that president poroshenko and prime minister yatsenuk can continue the reform efforts they have made. i'm glad to see because of our cooperation and our efforts we're starting to see a package come together with the imf with the european union and others that can help bolster the european economy so they have the space to continue to execute some of the reforms and anticorruption measures that they have made.
one of the most important things we can do for ukraine is help them succeed economically because that he's how people on the ground people feel this change this transformation inside of ukraine. if that experiment fails then the larger project of an independent ukraine will fail and so we're going to do everything we can to help bolster that but there's no doubt that if in fact diplomacy fails this week, there's going to continue to be a strong unified response between the united states and europe. that's not going to change there may be areas where there are tactical disagreements, there may not be, but the broad principle that we have to stand up for the not just ukraine but principle of territorial integrity and sovereignty is where where we're completely unified.
>> translator: the french president and i have decided to make one further attempt to make progress through a through diplomatic means of the we have the minsk agreement. it has never been implemented. the country the situation has actually worsened on the ground so now there is a possibility to try and bring about a cease-fire and to, also create conditions that, that are in place where you have not every day civilians dying, civil victims that fall prey to this. and i'm absolutely confident that we will do this together. i myself actually would not be able to live with not having made this attempt. so there is anything but an assured success in all of this, i have to be very clear about this but if at a certain point
in time one has to say that a success is not possible even if one puts every effort into it then the united states and europe have to sit together and try and explore further possibilities, what one can do. just let me point out here that foreign ministers of the european union last week already tasked the commission to think about further possible sanctions. on the issue of what is effective and what's not i'm somewhat surprised sometimes just, let me mention iran. for a fairly long period of time we have had sanctions in place there. people don't seem to question them and i think they have been fairly successful if we look at the current state of affairs with the negotiations on the nuclear program. so i think it was a very good thing to put some costs on to the russians through these sanctions that we agreed on
because we see also that russia seems to be influenced by this and this is why i am 100% behind these decisions. as to the export of arms i have given you my opinion but you may rest assured that no matter what we decide, the alliance between the united states and europe will continue to stand will continue to be solid even though, on certain issues we may not always agree but this partnership, be it on ukraine and russia be it on combating terrorism on the international stage, be it on earth issues it is a partnership that has stood the test of time and that is, i mean in europe we're very close but this transatlantic partnership for germany is indispensable and this will remain so and i can say this on behalf of my colleagues in the european union.
sorry, i have to call you myself. from dpa the german press agency. you said you have not yet made a cities as to whether weapons ought to be delivered to ukraine, what would be your red line? what would be the red line that needs to be crossed for you to decide a armament of the ukrainian army? and what do you think this will hold by way of a promise? because the chancellor said this will make matters worse? what can nobel laureate do more to diffuse this conflict? president putin demanded fenn the government in kiev negotiate directly with separatist its. when do you i think the right moment has come to do this and with looking at all of the big issues that you discussed this breach of confidence due to the nsa affair, of the u.s.-german relations, has that played a
role today? >> you want to go first? >> translator: i can gladly start. the question as to how one assesses the effectiveness of certain measures has been actually dealt with. the president has not made a decision as he said. what is important to me that we stand very closely together on the question of renewed diplomatic effort. we keep each other informed. we're in close touch and nobody wishes more for a success than the two of us who stand here side by side but this would also mean, not only having a cease-fire in place but also to overand above that, having certain rules in place. you said the russian president and himself says there ought to be direct contrasts.
let me point out these direct contrasts exist with the contact group with representatives from donetsk and uhansk. problems with the last few days and problems with the last meetings there was not really that much of an end result. if they met at all, or if representatives from donetsk and lugansk were there at all. sometimes they didn't even arrive. this after all was the core of the minsk agreement that there were local he elections according to the ukrainian constitution and outcome of that that you have representatives and authorities that can speak for these regions and ukrainian president has paved the way for this, to giving certain specific status to the talks at lugansk and donetsk. these are essential point for us to say maybe there can be context without the trilateral
group. this is on agenda of many talks we need to make. i can very well understand the ukrainian side, on the territory they consider to be part of their territory and that anything else would violate their territorial integrity that they want to actually see that elections take place there and that has also been stated by president putin that he wishes to see those elections happen. think there are still different assessments on individual issues there but if we look at the shear dimension of the terrorist threat, we're more aware of the pact we need to work closely together and i as german chancellor want to state here very clearly that the institutions of the united states of america have provided us and still continue to provide us with a lot of very significant, very important information that also to our security and we don't want to do with that. there are other possibilities as to the cyber dialogue for
example, to continue to talk about the sort of protection of privacy versus data protection and so on and security but this was basically combating terrorism was basically in the forefront today. >> providing lethal weapons to ukraine, it's important to point out that we have been vaing -- providing military assistance to the ukraine. that's a long standing nato relationship with the ukraine and the goal has not been for ukraine to be equipped to carry on offensive operations but to simple defend itself and the president has been very clear he's not interested in escalating violence. he's interested in having his country's boundaries respected by its neighbor.
so there's not going to be any specific point at which i say ah you know, clearly lethal defensive weapons would be appropriate here. it is our ongoing analysis of what can we do to dissuade russia from encroaching further and further on ukrainian territory. our hope is that that's done through diplomatic means and i just want to emphasize here once again for the benefit of not just of the american people but for the german people, we are not looking for russia to fail. we are not looking for russia to be surrounded and contained and weakened. our preference is for a strong prosperous vibrant confident russia that can be a partner with us on a whole host of global challenges. that's how i operated throughout
my first term in office. unfortunately, russia has made a decision that i think is bad for them strategically and bad for europe bad for the world. and so in the face of this aggression and these bad decisions, you know we can't simply try to talk them out of it. we have to show them that the world is unified and imposing a cost for this aggression and that's what we're going to continue to do. with respect to the n.s. achl, i'll just make this point very briefly. there's no doubt that the snowden revelations damaged impressions of germans with respect to the u.s. government and our intelligence
cooperation. and what i have done over the last year, year and a half is to systematically work through some of these issues to create greater transparency and to restore confidence not just for germans but for our partners around the world and we've taken some unprecedented measures. for example, to ensure that our intelligence agencies treat non u.s. citizens in ways that are consistent with due process and their privacy concerns. something that i put in a presidential order and has not been ever done not only by our intelligence agencies but i think by most intelligence agencies around the world. there are going to still be areas where we've got to work through the issues.
we have to work through some issues because they're complicated, they're difficult. if we are trying to track a network that is planning to carry out attacks in new york or berlin or paris and they are communicating primarily in cyber space and we have the capacity to stop an attack like that but that requires us then being able to operate within that cyber space, how do we make sure we're able to do that carry out these functions while still meeting our core principles respecting the privacy of all our people? and given germany's history, i recognize the sensitivities around this issue. what i would ask is that the german people recognize that the united states has always been on the forefront of trying to
promote civil liberties, that we have traditions of due process that we respect, that we have been a consistent partner of yours in the course of the last 70 years and certainly the last 25 years and reinforcing the values we share. so occasionally, i would like the german people to give us the benefit of the doubt given our history as opposed to assuming the worst assuming that we have been consistently your strong partners and that we share a common set of values. if we had that fundamental underlying trust, there are going to be times where there are disa aagreements and both sides may make mistakes and they're going to be irritants like there are between friends but the underlying foundation for the relationship remains sound. christie parsons?
>> thank you, mr. president. the iran nuclear negotiators have now missed two deadlines. should the upcoming march deadline for talks be the time one? and what are the circumstances in which you think it would be wise to extend the talks? also, sir, some have suggested that you are outraged by the israeli prime minister's decision to address congress. is that so? how would you advise democrats who are considering a boycott? >> first of all, we understood from the start when we set up the interim agreement with iran that it would take some time to work through incredibly complex issues and a huge trust deficit between the united states and iran and the world and iran when it comes to the nuclear programs.
so i think there was always the assumption that although the interim agreement lasted a certain period of time that we would probably need more time to move forward. the good news is that there have been very serious discussions. that time has been well spent. during this period of time issues have been clarified, gaps have been narrowed. iranians have abided by the agreement so this is not a circumstance in which by talking they've been stalling and meanwhile advancing their program. to the contrary what we know is the program has not only been frozen but with respect to 20% enriched uranium, they've enriched it so we're in a better position than we were before the interim program was set up. having said all of that the issues now are sufficiently narrowed and sufficiently clarified.
we're at a point where they need to make a decision. we are presenting to them in a unified fashion the p 5 plus one supported by a coalition of countries around the world are presenting to them a deal that allows them to have peaceful nuclear power but gives us the absolute assurance that is verifiable that they are not pursuing a nuclear weapon. and if, in fact, what they claim is true which is they have no aspiration to get a nuclear weapon that in fact according to their supreme leader it would be contrary to their faith to obtain a nuclear weapon, if that is true there should be the possibility of getting a deal. they should be able to get the yes. but we don't know if that's going to happen.
they have their hard liners. they have their politics. and the point, i guess, at this juncture, i don't see a further extension being useful if they had not agreed to the basic formulation and the bottom line that the world requires to have confidence that they're not pursuing a nuclear weapon. now, if the framework for a deal is done, if people have a clear sense of what is required and there's some drafting and t's to cross and i's to dot, that's a different issue. but any view, and i presented this to members of congress is that we now know enough that the no longer technical. the issues now are, does iran have the political will and the desire to get a deal done?
and we could not be doing this were it not for the incredible cohesion and unity that's been shown by germany, by the other members of the p five plus one which i should acknowledge includes russia. this is an area where they've actually served a constructible and china has served a constructible and there's been no cracks on the p five plus one on the table and i think that's to the degree of which we're acting reasonably in trying to actually solve a problem. with respect to prime minister netanyahu as i've said before i talk to him all the time. our teams constantly coordinate. we have a practice of not meeting with leaders right
before their elections, two weeks before their elections. as much as i live ang laela, if they were two weeks from the election, she wouldn't be invited to the white house and i expect she wouldn't ask for one. so you know this is just -- some of this just has to do with how we do business. and i think it's important for us to maintain these protocols because the u.s.-israeli relationship is not about a particular party. this isn't a relationship founded on affinity between the labor party and the democratic
party or the republican party. this is the u.s.-israeli relationship that extends beyond parties. and has to do with that unbreakable bond we feel and our commitment to israel security and the shared values we have and it's a way to preserve that to make sure it doesn't get clouded with that could be perceived as partisan politics. whether that's accurate or not, that's a potential perception and that's something we have to guard against. now, i don't want to be coy. the prime minister and i have a very real difference around iran sanctions. i have been very clear and ang la agreed with me and david cameron agrees with me and others who are a member of the negotiations agree it does not make sense to sour the
negotiations a month or two before they're about to be completed and we should play that out if in fact we could get a deal then we should embrace that. if we can't get a deal then we have to make a set of decisions and as i've said to congress i'll be the first one to work with them to apply even stronger measures against iran. but what is the rush? unless your view is that it's not possible to get a deal with iran and it shouldn't even be tested. and that i cannot agree with because as president of the united states, i'm lieuingooking at what the options are if we don't get a diplomatic resolution. those options are narrow and not attractive. from the perspective of u.s. interests and i believe also israel's interests, although i cannot speak for the israeli government, it's far better if we can get a diplomatic
resolution. >> miss merkel the question is what will be effective in the ukrainian crisis and diplomacy as you said yourself has not brought about that much progress. do you understand the americans when they say we ought to now deliver weapons and ma what makes you feel confident that diplomacy will carry the day and the next few days and weeks and also what is your comment on the most recent comments of the greek prime minister who says, let's end those programs and i am going to stand by the promises i made during the election campaign? how do you en visit the further
incorporation with the grek government and to you, mr. president, i address the question, there's quite a lot of pressure by members of your government who say weapons should be delivered to the ukrainians. now, you yourself have said you want to ratchet up the costs that vladmir putin has to bear and then make him relent and give in maybe and you said all options have to be on the table. so apparently also weapons. what makes you so sure that these weapons will not only go into the hands of the ukrainian army but also perhaps get in the hands of separatists, of militias on the ukrainian side who are accused amnesty international of having violated human rights? thank you. >> whenever you have political conflict such as the one now between russia and the ukraine but also in many other conflicts around the world, it has always
proved to be right to try again and again to sort such a conflict. we've spoken at some lengthed about the ukrainian conflict, too. we're expected to try time and again and there's always a point where you say all the options are on the table. we've gone back and forth but then one has to think again. looking just at the middle east conflict for example, how many people have tried to bring about a solution to this conflict? and that's welcomed but every time and i'm going to participate and support it every time because i think every time it's been well worth the effort. when you have a situation now where every night you see people dying, civilian casualskazcasualtyiescasualties it is incumbent upon us as politicians. we owe it to the people to explore every avenue until somebody gives in but we've grown up under conditions i have to point this again, where
we said nobody would have dreamt of german unity. the people who have said in west germany, remember they said, well, should we keep citizenship of germany? they've been criticized by people as some who have a revengist idea and then think of president reagan when he said mr. gorbachev, tear down the wall. many people said how can he say that? but he was right. we have no guarantee. i cannot give you a guarantee for the wednesday talks or further talks and maybe nothing will come out of it but then we're called again about a new possibility and since we thought about every step of the way, will this be effective or not, we'll continue to do so. a lot of things have to be thought about and i'm very glass that with the american president, i've always been able to put all the cards on the table and discuss the pros and cons in my speech in munich i gave you clearly where i stand.
but we'll continue to try it. i think that's why we're politicians. that's why we chose this profession. others have to do other things. researchers have to all the time find new things to explore and people have to -- and we have to see and the well-being, the prosperity of people is in short but we never have a guarantee that the policies we adopt would work, would have the effect -- sorry. greece. i almost forgot. yes. on wednesday, there's going to be a euro group meeting and i think what counts is what gross will -- greece will put on the table at that meeting or perhaps a few days later. german policy ever since 2010 has been aimed at greece staying a member of the euro zone. i've said this time and again but basic rules have always been
the same. you'll put in your own efforts and on the other side you're being shown solidarity. the preinstitutions, the e.c.b. the european commission and i.m.f. have agreed on programs. these program are the basis of any discussion we have. i've always said i will wait for gross -- greece to come with a sustainable proposal and we'll talk about. >> the point angela made is right, i think, which is we never have guarantees that any particular course of action works. as i've said before by the time a decision reaches my desk by definition, it's a hard problem with no easy answers. otherwise, somebody else would have solved it and i would never even hear about it. the issue that you raise about
can we be certain that any lethal aid that we provide ukraine is used properly doesn't fall into the wrong hands, does not lead to overaggressive actions that can't be sustained by the ukrainians, what kinds of reactions does it prompt want simply from the operatists but from russians those all have to be considered. the measure by which i make these decisions is is it more likely to be effective than not? and that is what our deliberations will be about. but what i do know is this. that the united states and europe have not stood idly by. we have made enormous efforts,
enormous investments of dollars, of political capital, of diplomacy in trying to resolve this situation. i think the ukrainian people can feel confident that we have stood by them. people like vice president biden and secretary of state kerry have spent countless hours on this issue as has angela and her team on the german side. and just because we have not yet gotten the outcome we want doesn't mean that this pressure is not over time making a difference. i think it's fair to say that there are those inside russia who recognize this has been a disastrous course for the russian economy.
i think mr. vladmir putin is factoring that in. but understandably until the situation is intoirly resolved we're going to have to keep trying different things to see if we can get a better outcome. what i do know is that we will not be able to succeed unless we maintain the strong trans atlantic solidarity that's been the hallmark of our national security throughout the last 70 years and i'm confident that i've got a great partner in angela in maintaining that. thank you very much, everybody. >> all right. so we have been watching this for the better part of 35 40 minutes, president obama and german chancellor angela merkel as they've talked about a host of issues but really keying in on the crisis in ukraine right now and those pro russian rebels that are fighting now in eastern ukraine and i was reading this
morning, let's bring it back out to the couch really what is at stake here. i heard angela merkel put it into words. peaceful environment of all of europe is in danger as russia in her words violates the principle of territory integrity. there are people in eastern ukraine, 10 days now, no running water, no heat no electricity and i think you talked earlier about, where would they go? they've been trying to evacuate. many people don't want to leave their homes because they're afraid. >> many are forced out of their homes. >> it's really a disasterrous situation. >> you have 5,000 dead already from this conflict and he said they violated just about every commitment they made, meaning the russians and vladmir putin and she said russia is in violation on two different fronts so they're in agreement on both of those points so why is nothing happening? why is nothing moving forward? why do they continue to pursue
language and talking instead of taking action? i think the big elephant in the room there it's iran and it came up at the very end about the deadline at what point would you consider extending that deadline or perhaps drawing it to a close. he got real cles close to saying i would not extend any longer this deadline for iran but if you put a few caveats in there, if you're going to allow iran's discussions for a few months, that gives vladmir putin two more months to do what he needs to do in the ukraine. >> as that was playing out, andrea your thoughts on what vladmir putin is doing. in all seriousness, you probably think he might be watching this. >> yeah. yawning and doing pushups. he's winning. he's winning the power struggle. and the e.u. is losing. e.u. a long time ago tossed aside the defense budgets and strong military in favor of a
welfare state and vladmir putin knows that. in the meantime the russians are beefing up their military beefing up nuclear ambitions doing the opposite. power is in a vacuum. vladmir putin knows that better than anybody. also you look at the power that russia is spreading. vladmir putin could take the ukraine whenever he wants. >> he took crimea. >> we can do nothing about it. i don't think obama is prepared to do anything. we've heard from the administration that sanctions are working. here is the deal though. vladmir putin doesn't care about financial sanctions. he cares about restoring that respect that russia lost during the cold war. they have a very high threshold for pain especially vladmir putin because remember he's a totalitarian -- he's not a total totalitarian. he's also thinking, too, remember that mistake that the u.s. made. we duly supported the overthrow
of the former ukrainian president. remember that? we mettled in this mess first and vladmir putin knows that. >> we're inching toward this deadline and on wednesday, we will not be at the table but we'll have other tables. we have a deadline. what are your thoughts just in terms of how different these -- i mean you heard president obama may be inch closer to some things that sounded stronger. angela merkel saying we want to give them more time. do you think they're that different? is it good cop, bad cop? >> i think the point should have been to make vladmir putin nervous. i think vladmir putin should have been watching and been nervous about what the leaders of both countries could potential cool and i think the goal was to express solidarity, that we're on the same page but the first question and these were great questions by the press, the first question illuminated that's not the case. the two countries are not on the same page and i think that's
part of the problem. so my concern is does this make vladmir putin more excited about his position? you know what? i'm free to do whatever i want. these guys are ready to balk keep talking and they talk about diplomatic solutions. that sounds great except that vladmir putin is not interested in that really and he knows that. you need people to get to the podium and make the person who has the potential to do more harm uncomfortable and i'm not sure that happened today. >> what happens if no deal is reached this week? that was part of that wrap around first question. the president said i've advised my team to look at all options, including lethal defense options on the table and that was really strong. >> will that happen? the consensus, we were talking, doubt that's going to happen. he said we can't stand idle. we have to bolster our presence. the prospect of military involvement, he did say, is very low. so maybe sending weapons, maybe sending lethal defensive weapons would be appropriate if there's
no cease fire. we'll have to see on wednesday but the t press conference, i feel like if you're watching, if vladmir putin is watching, he's saying, these two individuals, they're pushovers. >> that's right. >> he was asked what is his red line in the ukraine and there was no -- there was no clearance given. >> they're hoping the sanctions force some force the resolution. there's no vital u.s. interest in ukraine. so i don't see president obama stepping up to do anything. >> if he's not going to do anything about isis is he doing anything about this? >> red line is what they were alluding to with this question and we've seen the president get in trouble with that lingo so we didn't think he would double down. >> the answer that was given suggests they will continue talking and consider sanctions. >> good to have you here today. >> awesome hour. it's been fascinating.
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